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02:07:25<pabs>https://1.6.0.0.8.0.0.b.e.d.0.a.2.ip6.arpa/@domi/statuses/01JJS6BMXVDJTQFTRVX4ZKR2GW
02:10:04<pabs>Debian moves off Twitter https://micronews.debian.org/2025/1738154246.html
02:10:32<pabs>(was auto-synced from micronews.d.o)
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02:50:12<steering>I love how that rdns-domain points to... Cloudflare.
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02:51:23<testing|m><pabs> "https://1.6.0.0.8.0.0.b.e.d.0.a...." <- lollll
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02:56:01<steering>I wish I could afford to do that :P
03:06:16<steering>oh oh oh they mention buttflare on the /about
03:06:18<steering>OF NOTE: due to the domain situation, this server is hosted behind a clownflare proxy (that's the only way we found to get a TLS certificate issued for an .arpa zone). Do not assume privacy.
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03:17:21<testing|m>oh cloudflare
03:17:25<testing|m>I don't care anymore
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04:29:28<nukke>https://www.phoronix.com/news/Ubuntu-Developers-Matrix
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04:35:16<nulldata>https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/team_chat_2x.png
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04:52:08<nukke>ircv3 is still not finalized in 2051
04:52:24<nukke>I wonder if they'll skip v3 and jump straight into v4
04:53:16<@JAA>They stopped versioning altogether.
04:53:38<@JAA>There was 3.1 and 3.2, but it's all designed to be backwards-compatible anyway, so what's the point?
04:53:56<nicolas17>every time I use Matrix it makes me want to see how good XMPP implementations are nowadays
04:54:26<nicolas17>it's like seeing new C++ features and thinking "I should learn Rust"
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05:17:08<monoxane>every time I use matrix I stop using matrix
05:17:12<nukke>it doesn't help that matrix is *slow*.
05:21:07<monoxane>remember when matrix tried to create several brand new protocols to improve performances and reduce data only to ditch them all cos no one wanted to implement them
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05:22:01<nulldata>Someone should develop a new universal chat standard that covers everyone's use cases!
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05:49:04<steering>>designed to be backwards-compatible
05:49:10<steering>>breaks backwards-compatibility every chance they get
05:49:11<steering>:)
05:49:16<steering>I mean wait what
05:49:41<steering>nicolas17: don't worry, XMPP is still awful
05:50:06<@JAA>Hmm?
05:50:38<@JAA>What breaks backwards compatibility?
05:51:27<@JAA>Not wanting to break backward compatibility is one of the key reasons why multiline still isn't finalised. :-D
05:52:34<steering>does a server implementing userhost-in-names work with a client expecting uhnmames? ;)
05:53:04<steering>(I mean, sure they "work" in that you can still chat, but you can't use a feature that older servers would've supported with that client)
05:53:56<@JAA>I don't think it's reasonable to expect compatibility with every IRC extension that ever existed.
05:53:57<steering>and in many cases they've "kept backward compatibility" by just not sending things to some clients (even stuff that would've been sent to all clients by major servers previously)
05:54:58<steering>(see also multi-prefix)
05:55:25<@JAA>Yeah
05:55:42<@JAA>That's just mess inherited from before IRCv3 and its capability negotiation was a thing.
05:55:48<steering>(but then in other cases they "can't break backwards compatibility" when adding multiline)
05:56:51<@JAA>Properly standardising that is part of why IRCv3 exists, as I understand it.
05:57:25<@JAA>Previously, we had RFC 1459 and the newer RFCs nobody used plus numerous extensions whose documentation ranged from poor to not.
05:58:00<steering>ehhhhhhh
05:58:17@JAA gestures at WHOX.
05:58:20<steering>changing the way something that already works works isn't "properly standardising" so much as that one xkcd
05:58:33<steering>https://xkcd.com/927/
06:00:01<@JAA>That assumes that it 'already worked'. There was zero interoperability with many of those extensions, and each ircd did its own thing instead, with client devs then getting burdened to support all the quirks.
06:00:26<@JAA>Obviously, standardising that will lead to changes, yeah.
06:00:28<steering>IDK, what problems were there with uhnames and multi-prefix?
06:01:14<steering>IMO it was more just "we decided to use CAP, we're going to ignore PROTOCTL and make ituse CAP instead" -> of course new stuff is going to drop the old one
06:03:14<@JAA>Getting sent multiple prefixes before multi-prefix was non-negotiable IIRC.
06:03:19<steering>right
06:03:52<steering>(so clients were already having to deal with it)
06:04:19<steering>I'm not even saying they were bad decisions necessarily
06:04:37<steering>Just that "backwards compatibility"... to what? To the stuff they care about, sure :P
06:05:33<@JAA>At the core, to standardised IRC, basically.
06:05:51<@JAA>Which makes sense considering so much of the rest is poorly documented.
06:06:26<@JAA>And standardised IRC is pretty much RFC 1459 with some clarifications.
06:06:46<@JAA>Maybe the modern horse will turn into an RFC one day. A better RFC 281x.
06:15:21<steering>That would be nice.
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11:37:57<PotatoProton01>anyone online?
11:48:23<masterx244|m>pong;
11:50:57<PotatoProton01>obama
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14:12:37<that_lurker>Thanks, Obama
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15:00:40<murb>grr
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