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| 01:04:12 | <Xe> | I had a thought regarding archiveteam and anubis: web bot auth: https://developers.cloudflare.com/bots/concepts/bot/verified-bots/web-bot-auth/ |
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| 01:23:23 | <nexusxe2> | what stage of the process requires .warc files to be gzipped? a .warc i was moving from a remote server to my local machine went from a 975MiB .warc.gz to a 11.2MiB .warc.zst ... I know that zstandard is slower but for that kind of file size difference I would imagine it would be worth it? |
| 01:29:36 | <pokechu22> | I don't think anything specific requires .gz, but note that each record in the .warc.gz is compressed separately, rather than the whole warc being compressed on its own, so that it can seek to individual records |
| 01:29:51 | <pokechu22> | for archivebot, it's mostly legacy reasons with no real updates having been made to wpull in a while |
| 01:37:29 | <nexusxe2> | i assume the per-record compression is done for a reason, then? |
| 01:43:37 | <pokechu22> | Yeah, since web.archive.org needs to grab specific records from it and if it had to decompress the whole WARC every time that'd be a problem |
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| 03:30:22 | <@OrIdow6> | Xe: (And I have become the peanut gallery of this channel) I hate it's necessary but I do think it's the pragmatic option |
| 03:31:23 | <@OrIdow6> | Probably not for everything we do, just some tools |
| 03:32:16 | <@OrIdow6> | Also, I'm not sure Cloudflare would let us in haha |
| 03:32:28 | <@OrIdow6> | The vibe Anubis gives me makes me think they might be more amenable to it |
| 03:32:46 | <Xe> | I have good news about who you're talking to then :) |
| 03:36:44 | <Xe> | $ dig TXT +short hackint-proof.xeiaso.net |
| 03:43:46 | <alexshpilkin> | Xe: last I checked Cloudflare's stance on authorizing smaller bots (for e.g. indie search engines) was "piss off" |
| 03:44:23 | <alexshpilkin> | not that I'm suggesting that you would take such a stance |
| 03:45:29 | <alexshpilkin> | but I'm having a bit of a problem reading their docs in a sympathetic light because of that |
| 03:47:37 | <BlankEclair> | i assume that, wrt cloudflare, we're talking about <https://developers.cloudflare.com/bots/concepts/bot/verified-bots/>? |
| 03:48:36 | <anarcat> | uh |
| 03:48:39 | <anarcat> | Xe: hi. :) |
| 03:48:43 | <anarcat> | thanks for anubis |
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| 03:49:09 | <anarcat> | we (torproject.org) haven't deployed it yet, but i feel it's just going to happen soon |
| 03:49:23 | <anarcat> | it's amazing the amount of garbage we get thrown our way |
| 03:51:08 | <Xe> | you're welcome <3 |
| 03:51:12 | <Xe> | I'd say I can't imagine but |
| 03:51:12 | <BlankEclair> | think there are ai scrapers on the onion service? |
| 03:51:14 | <Xe> | I can |
| 03:51:18 | <BlankEclair> | or, well, even just onion services in general? |
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| 03:53:32 | <Xe> | I'd imagine not |
| 03:53:47 | <Xe> | v2 maybe because they were easy to sniff out at the relay level |
| 03:53:54 | <Xe> | v3 fixed a lot of that |
| 03:54:32 | <anarcat> | BlankEclair: not that i know of in particular |
| 03:54:39 | <BlankEclair> | ah oki :3 |
| 03:54:50 | <anarcat> | i mean there's fundamentally no reason why the bots wouldn't be able to use the .onions |
| 03:54:59 | <BlankEclair> | just that no one has bothered to do it :p |
| 03:55:01 | <anarcat> | they're publicly announced and not for hiding the serveers |
| 03:55:13 | <anarcat> | well it doesn't change anything, it would just make their crawls slower |
| 03:55:17 | <anarcat> | which, in fact, would be great |
| 03:55:25 | <BlankEclair> | oh yeah, forgot that tor is slow lol |
| 03:55:29 | <anarcat> | we've thought of shutting down gitlab behind a .onion to give them a big fuck off |
| 03:55:30 | <BlankEclair> | <-- probably should use tor more often |
| 03:56:01 | <anarcat> | i mean "slow", it's pretty fast, but there's a cost to building a new circuit, and i bet a bot writer would do it the wrong way and waste a lot of cycles |
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| 04:02:53 | <Xe> | BlankEclair: i used to do IPv6 over tor hidden services |
| 04:02:56 | <Xe> | you think you know slow |
| 04:03:02 | <BlankEclair> | my apologies |
| 04:03:05 | <Xe> | try TCP in TCP in onionland |
| 04:03:15 | <BlankEclair> | okay, jesus fuck |
| 04:03:23 | <BlankEclair> | i've done tcp over tcp before, but not w/ tor |
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| 04:24:00 | <@OrIdow6> | https://developers.cloudflare.com/bots/concepts/bot/verified-bots/ip-validation/ seems like it'd be difficult, only options are a static list and reverse DNS |
| 04:24:35 | <@OrIdow6> | Could not be used with distributed stuff |
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| 04:27:14 | <Xe> | I'm thinking web bot auth in particular |
| 04:27:21 | <Xe> | the signatures for HTTP requests |
| 04:50:36 | <nicolas17> | Xe: the request signatures would end up in the archived data |
| 04:50:49 | <nicolas17> | I don't immediately see a big problem with that since they expire and can't be replayed |
| 04:50:54 | <nicolas17> | but... something to keep in mind |
| 04:51:30 | <nicolas17> | WARCs preserve all HTTP request and response headers |
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| 07:07:50 | <@arkiver> | Xe: thanks for hopping on here again :) |
| 07:12:26 | <@arkiver> | quite some time ago i proposed something for use with anubis and possible cloudflare and other services |
| 07:12:53 | <@arkiver> | cloudflare for example has the "good bots" list (maybe they changed the name now, not sure), which i believe is mostly IP based. |
| 07:13:11 | <@arkiver> | for Archive Team that would not work of course, due to its distributed workings |
| 07:14:00 | <@arkiver> | something i though of was to create a key/string on the tracker and send that to anubis/cloudflare upon archiving with the note that up to x URLs will be archived in the coming y minutes. |
| 07:14:52 | <@arkiver> | then for the coming x URL and/or y minutes, requests with that key in the HTTP headers will be treated as "good bot" requests, and after the x URL and y minutes, the IP is treated as "bad/normal bot" again. |
| 07:22:40 | <BlankEclair> | i assume this is for dpos projects, right? |
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| 07:23:46 | <that_lurker> | arkiver: AB pipelines (maybe not all) could be added to the good bots list at least. |
| 07:24:09 | <BlankEclair> | this might be basic, but what if the tracker offered the clients (forgot the exact parlance) is given a signature of the client's ip + url + an expiry time |
| 07:24:23 | <BlankEclair> | then that sig can be given in a header for anubis to know that the request was given by the tracker |
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| 07:26:44 | <@arkiver> | that_lurker: yeah those could be actually |
| 07:26:51 | <@arkiver> | BlankEclair: yes this was for Warrior projects |
| 07:27:36 | <@arkiver> | BlankEclair: the exact URL could be problematic is the project might archive more than just the URLs given by the tracker |
| 07:27:48 | <@arkiver> | which is the reason for the number of minutes and number of URLs |
| 07:27:52 | <BlankEclair> | ah okay |
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| 08:25:18 | <Webuser643332> | Greetings! Can someone helping me archive this YouTube video? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXFCQFW77JA Reason: Unlisted. Thank you! |
| 08:30:19 | <that_lurker> | was done in #down-the-tube it seems |
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| 09:34:00 | <h2ibot> | Hans5958 created Microsoft Update (+3904, Add initial page): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Microsoft%20Update |
| 09:34:01 | <h2ibot> | Hans5958 edited Microsoft Update (-28): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56471&oldid=56470 |
| 09:34:02 | <h2ibot> | Hans5958 edited Microsoft Update (+34): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56472&oldid=56471 |
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| 09:38:01 | <h2ibot> | Hans5958 edited Glitch (+17, Clarify that it is inaccessible (Glitch is…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56473&oldid=56454 |
| 09:39:01 | <h2ibot> | Hans5958 edited Glitch (+5): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56474&oldid=56473 |
| 09:39:02 | <h2ibot> | Hans5958 edited Main Page/Current Projects (+69, Mention last deadline for Glitch): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56475&oldid=56347 |
| 09:41:02 | <h2ibot> | Hans5958 edited Main Page/Current Projects (+107, New project: Microsoft Update (assumed to be…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56476&oldid=56475 |
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| 09:59:06 | <h2ibot> | TriangleDemon edited Internet Archive (+130, /* Problems */): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56477&oldid=56436 |
| 09:59:07 | <h2ibot> | TriangleDemon edited Foro 3DJuegos (-5): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56478&oldid=54366 |
| 09:59:08 | <h2ibot> | TriangleDemon edited Nhentai (-6): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56479&oldid=53565 |
| 09:59:09 | <h2ibot> | TriangleDemon edited WeVidi (+32): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56480&oldid=55155 |
| 09:59:10 | <h2ibot> | TriangleDemon edited List of websites excluded from the Wayback Machine/Partial exclusions (+53): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56481&oldid=55793 |
| 09:59:11 | <h2ibot> | TriangleDemon edited List of websites excluded from the Wayback Machine (+105): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56482&oldid=56440 |
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| 10:00:07 | <h2ibot> | Hans5958 edited Main Page/Current Projects (+0, Move Microsoft Update to long-term): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56483&oldid=56476 |
| 10:01:06 | <h2ibot> | Hans5958 edited Microsoft Update (-6): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56484&oldid=56472 |
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| 11:46:13 | <@OrIdow6> | arkiver: What I was thinking was that it'd be nice to have a "component name" (the rfc's options of what can be signed) to identify the IP address requests will be coming from |
| 11:46:32 | <@OrIdow6> | h shoot I see BlankEclair already said that |
| 11:50:37 | <@OrIdow6> | I'm not in the mood to read the whole RFC draft now but it already requires the authority (ie the domain, which seems more flexible than URL) and expiry times |
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| 14:06:14 | <@arkiver> | OrIdow6: perhaps yeah, would that be a way for them to only trust an IP temporarily? |
| 14:06:27 | <@arkiver> | it's all about not having to trust the IP completely, but only temporarily |
| 14:06:47 | <@arkiver> | of course some ArchiveBot IPs could simply be trusted, but those used for the Warrior projects cannot |
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| 14:21:39 | | @OrIdow6-utm_source-AT3AIRC is now known as @OrIdow6-utm_source-AT^3AIRC |
| 14:23:25 | <@arkiver> | OrIdow6-utm_source-AT^3AIRC: you ok there? |
| 14:23:41 | <@OrIdow6-utm_source-AT^3AIRC> | arkiver: Per the conversation in -ot :) |
| 14:23:56 | <@OrIdow6-utm_source-AT^3AIRC> | Wow that looks tacky |
| 14:24:00 | | @OrIdow6-utm_source-AT^3AIRC is now known as @OrIdow6 |
| 14:26:16 | <@arkiver> | alright i see |
| 14:26:56 | <[42]> | are there known issues with ips getting listed by spamhaus xbl lately? |
| 14:27:09 | <@arkiver> | [42]: likely certainly if you run the #// project |
| 14:27:20 | <@arkiver> | if you run it at scale at least |
| 14:28:10 | <@OrIdow6> | arkiver: From my read of the RFC draft, the way it works is that with the request you send a litst of "component names", which are things like the domain, path, etc (and also nonce and validity times which are their own thing), then do a signature over this |
| 14:28:48 | <@OrIdow6> | So as this proposal stands it'd let us restrict it to (time range, domain), but I think it'd be nice to have address in there as a field too |
| 14:29:17 | <@OrIdow6> | Since otherwise handing one of these out with a dops is a free ticket to access the site from anywhere |
| 14:29:24 | <@OrIdow6> | Until it expires |
| 14:33:38 | <@OrIdow6> | The counter idea is nice too, maybe instead of the time range per se attach it to the nonce |
| 14:34:21 | <[42]> | arkiver: got 7 ips flagged in the last 2 days after not getting any reports for a long while |
| 14:34:34 | <@arkiver> | [42]: with #// ? |
| 14:34:52 | <@arkiver> | [42]: if you have any details on what they flagged on, please let me know (can PM) |
| 14:35:25 | <@arkiver> | OrIdow6: something like that may be nice yes. i hope to check in with Xe and cloudflare about this (cloudflare in progress) |
| 14:35:47 | <@OrIdow6> | The bad scenario is, I suppose: warrior becomes the golden ticket to bypassing all bot blocking, AI companies modify the warrior code to make up outlinks/redirects/etc to whatever domain they choose and get themselves issued signatures for that, AI companies distribute those signatures to their 10k aws machines and scrape away until the validity period expires |
| 14:36:07 | <[42]> | tinba c&c infra to a sinkhole at 216.218.185.162:80 |
| 14:36:10 | <[42]> | probably #// |
| 14:36:11 | <@arkiver> | though... I have not seen significant impact yet of the recent cloudflare changes |
| 14:36:15 | <@arkiver> | [42]: yeah likely :/ |
| 14:36:17 | <@arkiver> | #// |
| 14:36:56 | <@OrIdow6> | Probably as long as a particular warrior can't say "give me a signature for this domain please" we're not vulnerable to that |
| 14:37:08 | <@arkiver> | OrIdow6: and let's not give them any ideas :P |
| 14:38:37 | <@arkiver> | have we observed examples of cloudflares recent changes in the wild already? |
| 14:40:07 | <@OrIdow6> | arkiver: Haha fair |
| 14:41:44 | <[42]> | arkiver: i also have some domains linked to that if you're interested? they're all from DGAs though, so probably not that useful |
| 14:41:58 | <Xe> | arkiver: that's why i'm thinking that a single-factor signature would be best |
| 14:42:28 | <Xe> | have the warrior central server send out signatures with its jobs |
| 14:42:34 | <Xe> | use a bank of 16 keys or something |
| 14:42:36 | <Xe> | idk |
| 14:46:12 | <@arkiver> | Xe: yeah and the big difference between anubis and cloudflare would be its centrality. for anubis we would let specific site know in advance of what is coming |
| 14:46:45 | <@arkiver> | which also means we need to restrict a job to those few domains... which is possible. |
| 14:47:00 | <@arkiver> | certainly |
| 14:48:02 | <@arkiver> | Xe: is anubis still useragent based? |
| 14:48:24 | <Xe> | lol no, there's a lot of heuristics |
| 14:48:57 | <Xe> | i'm in the middle of adding TLS fingerprint heuristics |
| 14:50:27 | <@arkiver> | yeah those can be annoying |
| 14:51:41 | <Xe> | my favorite thing I've added though: https://anubis.techaro.lol/docs/admin/configuration/expressions |
| 14:51:46 | <Xe> | expression based heuristics |
| 14:54:57 | <@arkiver> | a simple `wget https://anubis.techaro.lol/` does seem to work |
| 14:55:39 | <@arkiver> | i do see there's a 200 on the bot check page, so will have to handle that in #// - we don't want that to pass for the actual page |
| 14:55:58 | <@arkiver> | Xe: can i assume https://anubis.techaro.lol/ is always up to date with the newest anubis? |
| 14:56:52 | | @arkiver grumbles at the rise of LLMs |
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| 15:13:43 | <anarcat> | oh wow, load-based checks, that's really nice |
| 15:14:04 | <anarcat> | okay, while we're pounding Xe with off topic stuff, let me add mine :) |
| 15:14:06 | <anarcat> | i feel privileged |
| 15:14:14 | <@arkiver> | certainly not off topic! |
| 15:14:30 | <anarcat> | well maybe not you but i will certainly venture there now :p |
| 15:14:31 | <@arkiver> | archiving could suffer, so i'm happy we're in contact with Xe about this |
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| 15:14:49 | <@arkiver> | good luck (remember #archiveteam-ot for very lengthy stuff though :P ) |
| 15:15:01 | <@arkiver> | (i see Xe is there) |
| 15:17:35 | <anarcat> | yeah, i asked there |
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| 16:39:34 | <justauser|m> | Is the data from 2015 SourceForge crawl available anywhere? |
| 16:39:52 | <justauser|m> | I'm specifically interested in rsync part. |
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| 16:46:38 | <@arkiver> | i believe we did not make a full copy back then justauser|m |
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| 16:58:34 | <h2ibot> | Cooljeanius edited Microsoft Update (+18, use URL template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56485&oldid=56484 |
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| 17:13:25 | <justauser|m> | Wiki confirms your belief, but you did at least something. |
| 17:14:08 | <justauser|m> | A whole 830.45GiB, according to tracker. |
| 17:17:31 | <@arkiver> | yeah i see this one at least https://archive.org/details/archiveteam-fire_20180112095222 |
| 17:17:37 | <@arkiver> | but not immediately more |
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| 17:22:10 | <@arkiver> | i have to hop off now though... |
| 17:22:12 | <@arkiver> | i have to hop off now though... |
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| 17:28:37 | <egallager> | https://ddosecrets.com/article/gaza-volume-02 |
| 17:35:27 | <Xe> | arkiver: it's always up to date |
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| 18:24:30 | <cuphead2527480> | Hey someone here? |
| 18:24:30 | <cuphead2527480> | Im trying to set "noindex" and "true" but keeps saying noindex is an exclusive field. You can only have one value. |
| 18:24:30 | <cuphead2527480> | I dont get it |
| 18:24:41 | <cuphead2527480> | Editing a metadata on AN item |
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| 18:27:46 | <cuphead2527480> | Hi dabs |
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| 18:30:43 | <dabs> | howdy |
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| 22:13:15 | <BlankEclair> | https://gamerant.com/steam-removed-games-publishing-rules-update/ |
| 22:13:16 | <BlankEclair> | ugh |
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| 22:22:45 | <nicolas17> | BlankEclair: https://64.media.tumblr.com/9163aa74a5eabf8069aef5e95bb71b8e/6910a51bfb2d48b6-64/s540x810/5216ac3d5ce948786a1426768fc1074f64665d94.png |
| 22:23:05 | <BlankEclair> | yeah... |
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| 22:53:29 | <nicolas17> | the xcode simulators are now showing up on wbm cdx api |
| 23:08:56 | <h2ibot> | Dango360 edited Roblox/uncopylocked (+108, added Nickelodeon Suites Resort by Guest368712): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=56486&oldid=56403 |
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