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02:15:27<pabs>whose bot is HadeanEon ?
02:15:46<pabs>(wiki editing bot)
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02:16:20<pabs>ah, I see from the page it is User:VoynichCr
02:17:22<@JAA>It's the bot that did the ArchiveBot/* things, too, then suddenly vanished a few years ago.
02:17:40<@JAA>I think it did one random Deaths* update at one point, then disappeared again.
02:18:25<pabs>seems to be working again now?
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02:41:24<h2ibot>PaulWise edited Blogger (+215, add thuban blogspot-checker.py, reword): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54730&oldid=54257
02:51:10<Webuser477549>Hello, I joined a week or two ago to ask about ArchiveTeam projects that appears to have been made private recently on archive.org. My understanding as that this was because it came to light that they were being used to train LLM products. My PC crashed shortly after so I never saw if there was a response. Does any know anything more about this?
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02:59:29<nicolas17>Webuser477549: I don't know what was the question a week ago and you likely have a different nickname now
03:02:17<Webuser477549>My question was basically just if my understanding was correct and if they was any plans to make them public again, or anyway for users to gain access
03:02:43<Webuser477549>And yeah I think my username was some 80's pop singer
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03:03:23<nicolas17>as I understand it, the main problem is that website owners and other copyright holders can ask archive.org to take down individual URLs
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03:03:35<nicolas17>and that can be done at the Wayback Machine level
03:04:10<nicolas17>however, it's not possible to filter out a single URL from a giant .warc that has thousands of saved webpages
03:04:45<nicolas17>so the only solution is to prevent downloading the .warc as a whole
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03:06:39<Webuser477549>Well I noticed it while I was exploring google+ on wayback and wanted to download the .warcs myself. It looks like all .warcs were made private in November. If I'm understanding you correctly, a takedown request would only affect the warc that contains the URL(s) in question
03:08:26<nicolas17>maybe there was one takedown request and the answer was "block everything from that project"
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03:08:35<nicolas17>too much work to identify the correct individual files
03:08:48<nicolas17>but "people downloading terabytes of warcs to train LLMs" is a possible secondary reason
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03:17:26<Webuser477549>I believe that such a request would appear in Lumen, I'll take a look
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03:32:58<Webuser477549>Not seeing anything related to those warcs, but I'm also not seeing any take down requests for archive.org since 2018 which doesn't seem right...
03:33:05<Webuser477549>Thank you for the info nicolas17
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03:40:46<Webuser268702>democraciaobrera
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03:43:39<nicolas17>I'm 50% speculating
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04:13:08<Webuser477549>Speculative info is still info :)
04:15:07<Webuser477549>Do you have any idea where I should go from here? If I stay in IRC, is it likely someone else with more direct knowledge will give their input?
04:30:47<nicolas17>¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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05:23:51<pabs>contact archive.org probably?
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06:47:58<that_lurker>nicolas17: If I remember correctly arkiver set all archiveteam collections to be private by default. (Maybe because of the AI scraping issue that was risen a while back)
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11:35:52<h2ibot>Usernam edited List of websites excluded from the Wayback Machine/Partial exclusions (+160, …): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54731&oldid=54527
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12:01:16<@arkiver>that_lurker: yes that was a major factor
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12:41:48<masterx244|m>sucks though. that LLM pest is destroying the useful resources on the interwebs :(
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14:33:57<gamer191>Is https://irclogs.archivete.am/ down?
14:41:01<steering>probably
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15:05:44<@arkiver>JAA: FYI on irclogs - did you run that?
15:05:58<@arkiver>i believe bzc6p (not here) has been doing some archiving of https://indafoto.hu/
15:25:36VoynichCR (VoynichCR) joins
15:28:22<@arkiver>checking in with them
15:39:35<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Template:Infobox project (+93, adding language parameter): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54732&oldid=54717
15:39:36<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Template:Infobox project (+14): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54733&oldid=54732
15:40:19<@arkiver>masterx244|m: 100% agreed
15:40:35<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Wikispecies (+21): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54734&oldid=54726
15:40:56<@arkiver>due to this, we cannot create the view that "webarchiving == data collection for LLMs". that will kill support for web archiving very very fast
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15:41:25<@arkiver>the current system allow for limited playback through the Wayback Machine, for people not trying to pull huge amounts of data, that should work well enough
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15:54:38<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Template:Infobox project (+317, testing up to 3 langs): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54736&oldid=54733
15:56:38<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Template:Infobox project (+132, autocat): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54737&oldid=54736
15:57:38<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Spanish Revolution (+21, | language = Spanish): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54738&oldid=47776
15:57:39<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Spanish Revolution (+18): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54739&oldid=54738
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15:58:38<h2ibot>VoynichCr created Category:Infobox project pages without language (+161, Created page with "This category includes pages…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Category%3AInfobox%20project%20pages%20without%20language
15:58:39<h2ibot>HadeanEon edited Deaths in 2018 (+101894, BOT - Updating page: {{saved}} (458),…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54741&oldid=42801
15:58:40<h2ibot>HadeanEon edited Deaths in 2018/list (+4428, BOT - Updating list): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54742&oldid=42802
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15:59:38<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Template:Infobox project (+78, autocat for maintenance): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54743&oldid=54737
16:05:04<Krownest>At the risk of sounding ignorant, and just out of curiosity, why do we care what people do with the end result of what we archive? Like, I get not wanting to get tied that the project just exists to feed LLMs, but that's clearly not what our goal here is, but if someone is using that data for it, so what?
16:14:16egallager joins
16:14:28<egallager>hey VoynichCR
16:15:25<VoynichCR>hello egallager
16:16:11<egallager>so, it looks like you have some experience with the MediaWiki template system? And porting Wikipedia templates to this wiki?
16:17:04<VoynichCR>maybe, some templates are hell, and they use Module extension, not available in archiveteam wiki
16:19:04<@arkiver>Krownest: it will negatively affect general support for web archiving, and may cause web sites to be more aggressively block us
16:19:18<VoynichCR>if you have any question, just ask, and if i can help i will do it egallager
16:20:08<egallager>I would like to have {{as_of}} available here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:As_of
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16:21:27<VoynichCR>what parameters and functionality you want to use, tell me some examples
16:24:46<egallager>just the basics, I mostly just want to have the categories like these available: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Articles_containing_potentially_dated_statements
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16:26:41<VoynichCR>so {{As of|2025}} -> As of 2025, and when year is < currentyear, autocat the page in a maintenance category of dated statements
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16:28:19<egallager>plus the little superscript saying `[update]`
16:29:24<VoynichCR>ok, that sounds easy, i am gonna create a first approach, adding more params on top later if needed
16:32:34<egallager>thanks!
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16:36:44<h2ibot>VoynichCr created Template:As of (+338, Created page with "As of {{{1|NO…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Template%3AAs%20of
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16:37:34<VoynichCR>egallager check this https://wiki.archiveteam.org/index.php/Template:As_of
16:37:57<egallager>"Expression error: Unexpected < operator."
16:38:17<VoynichCR>well, that happens only in the template page because no year is defined by default
16:38:51<VoynichCR>use the template in a page and tell me
16:42:45<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Template:As of (+58, adding autocat to [[Category:Pages containing…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54747&oldid=54746
16:42:46<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Template:As of (+27): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54748&oldid=54747
16:43:45<h2ibot>VoynichCr created Category:Pages containing potentially dated statements (+171, Created page with "This category includes pages…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Category%3APages%20containing%20potentially%20dated%20statements
16:45:45<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Template:As of (+127): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54750&oldid=54748
16:48:46<h2ibot>HadeanEon edited Deaths in 2019 (+153886, BOT - Updating page: {{saved}} (489),…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54751&oldid=42803
16:48:47<h2ibot>HadeanEon edited Deaths in 2019/list (+8864, BOT - Updating list): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54752&oldid=42804
16:55:43<egallager>Expression error: Unrecognized word "february".
16:56:07<VoynichCR>paste here the code you typed
16:56:22<@arkiver>(i sent an email to bzc6p, more on indafoto https://wiki.archiveteam.org/index.php/Indafot%C3%B3 )
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16:56:41<egallager>it comes from trying to edit the "Strategy" section of: https://wiki.archiveteam.org/index.php/Blogger
16:57:05<egallager>{{as of|February 2020}}
16:57:56<VoynichCR>that's not how the template is used, here or wikipedia
16:58:12<VoynichCR>it is {{as of|YEAR}} or {{as of|YEAR|MONTHNUMBER}}
16:58:30<DigitalDragons>is the upload of backlogged warcs still ongoing?
16:58:55<VoynichCR>egallager im gonna fix it, wait
16:59:41<@imer>DigitalDragons: yes, very slowly though
17:00:31<DigitalDragons>is there an estimate of how much is left? just out of curiosity
17:03:12<@imer>hundreds of tbs :|
17:03:39<@JAA>Yes, I run irclogs. As mentioned before, it's not officially considered stable, nor was it ever officially announced anywhere. So don't expect it to be up at any given time.
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17:05:33<VoynichCR>egallager try now
17:05:48<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Template:As of (+410, adding support for months, in word and number…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54753&oldid=54750
17:05:49<h2ibot>HadeanEon created Deaths in 2020 (+433014, BOT - Updating page: {{saved}} (41),…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Deaths%20in%202020
17:05:50<h2ibot>HadeanEon created Deaths in 2020/list (+33004, BOT - Updating list): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Deaths%20in%202020/list
17:08:49<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Template:As of (+76, adding link to [edit] when update is shown): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54756&oldid=54753
17:12:49<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Blogger (+4, /* Strategy */ use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54757&oldid=54730
17:14:53<VoynichCR>egallager ;) https://wiki.archiveteam.org/index.php/Category:Pages_containing_potentially_dated_statements
17:15:11<egallager>seems to work now, thanks!
17:15:38<VoynichCR>np
17:15:45<egallager>I wonder if it works with the {{datetime}} template...
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17:16:50<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited WikiApiary (+4, use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54759&oldid=54720
17:17:15<egallager>ok it looks like it works when {{datetime}} is used for just a year, at least...
17:18:15<VoynichCR>yeah, but why use datetime for year only? what is the puporse of datetime?
17:19:14<egallager>idk, I was just editing WikiApiary and found a sentence already written like that...
17:20:14<@JAA>The purpose is a standardised mechanism for entering datetimes so that they're always formatted the same.
17:20:41<@JAA>And it uses the user's date format preference.
17:21:02<VoynichCR>ah i see
17:21:53<VoynichCR>in this case where only year is used, i dont see much difference, unless it converts to other calendars, like the persian, chinese, etc
17:22:14<VoynichCR>or unixtime :p
17:22:24<@JAA>It doesn't even support that, really.
17:22:31<@JAA>It's for date + optional time.
17:22:58<@JAA>It's also different from 'as of' because it's used for shutdown times etc.
17:23:25<@JAA>The newer sections on [[Deathwatch]] use it, for example.
17:23:43<@JAA>So we wouldn't want that to end up in a category like that.
17:24:21<@JAA>But {{as of}} could maybe make use of {{datetime}}, at least when it has a full date or datetime.
17:26:52<h2ibot>HadeanEon created Deaths in 2021 (+431831, BOT - Updating page: {{saved}} (40),…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Deaths%20in%202021
17:26:53<h2ibot>HadeanEon created Deaths in 2021/list (+33273, BOT - Updating list): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Deaths%20in%202021/list
17:29:53<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Deathwatch (+4, /* 2017 */ use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54763&oldid=54559
17:31:35<egallager>`lc=y` parameter would be useful
17:33:58<VoynichCR>lowercase yes, ok
17:35:43<VoynichCR>done
17:35:54<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Deathwatch (+9, /* Eleventh Hour Reprieves and Reanimations */…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54764&oldid=54763
17:35:55<h2ibot>VoynichCr edited Template:As of (+151, adding lc=y param for lowercase as of): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54765&oldid=54756
17:38:54<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited YouTube (+4, /* Discussions/Channel Comments (October 2021)…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54766&oldid=54507
17:39:54<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited YouTube (+4, /* Video counter */ use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54767&oldid=54766
17:40:54<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited YouTube (+8, /* Comment loading */ use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54768&oldid=54767
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17:41:54<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited YouTube (+4, /* Inactive accounts policy */ Use "as of"…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54769&oldid=54768
17:43:55<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Facebook (+4, use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54770&oldid=54230
17:44:55<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Alive... OR ARE THEY (+4, /* Endangered */ use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54771&oldid=54243
17:46:55<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Alive... OR ARE THEY (+4, /* Alarm */ use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54772&oldid=54771
17:47:56<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Mastodon (+4, use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54773&oldid=54284
17:49:56<h2ibot>HadeanEon created Deaths in 2022 (+438395, BOT - Updating page: {{saved}} (195),…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Deaths%20in%202022
17:49:57<h2ibot>HadeanEon created Deaths in 2022/list (+32727, BOT - Updating list): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Deaths%20in%202022/list
17:49:58<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Twitter (+9, /* Vital Signs */ use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54777&oldid=54084
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17:50:56<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Imgur (+4, /* Vital Signs */ use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54778&oldid=51790
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18:14:00<h2ibot>HadeanEon edited Deaths in 2023 (+328074, BOT - Updating page: {{saved}} (167),…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54791&oldid=50836
18:14:01<h2ibot>HadeanEon edited Deaths in 2023/list (+12901, BOT - Updating list): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54792&oldid=50837
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18:32:02<h2ibot>Exorcism edited Bugzilla (+38, /* Archived */): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54797&oldid=54644
18:41:04<h2ibot>HadeanEon created Deaths in 2024 (+466965, BOT - Updating page: {{saved}} (178),…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Deaths%20in%202024
18:41:05<h2ibot>HadeanEon created Deaths in 2024/list (+32069, BOT - Updating list): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Deaths%20in%202024/list
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18:45:04<h2ibot>HadeanEon edited Deaths in 2025 (+23332, BOT - Updating page: {{saved}} (15),…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54806&oldid=54673
18:45:05<h2ibot>HadeanEon edited Deaths in 2025/list (+76, BOT - Updating list): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54807&oldid=54674
18:53:06<h2ibot>VoynichCr created Template:Database dump (+114, Created page with "[[:Category:Database…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Template%3ADatabase%20dump
18:54:06<h2ibot>VoynichCr created Category:Database dumps (+101, Created page with "A '''database dump''' is an…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Category%3ADatabase%20dumps
18:54:07<h2ibot>VoynichCr created Template:HTML dump (+102, Created page with "[[:Category:HTML dumps|HTML…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Template%3AHTML%20dump
18:55:06<h2ibot>VoynichCr created Category:HTML dumps (+102, Created page with "A '''HTML dump''' is an…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Category%3AHTML%20dumps
18:55:07<h2ibot>VoynichCr created Template:ZIM (+82, Created page with…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Template%3AZIM
18:56:06<h2ibot>VoynichCr created Category:ZIM (+118, Created page with "A '''ZIM''' file is a…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Category%3AZIM
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19:25:16<h2ibot>HadeanEon created Spanish Wikipedia (+67088, BOT - Creating page): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Spanish%20Wikipedia
19:28:25<VoynichCR>what do you think of creating pages like this for other wikipedias, to have a better view of the available dumps? https://wiki.archiveteam.org/index.php/Spanish_Wikipedia
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19:34:55<@JAA>I don't think we need a separate page for every Wikimedia project.
19:35:50<@JAA>I'd rather see a single page with links to IA searches that return the items.
19:36:17<h2ibot>HadeanEon edited Spanish Wikipedia (+2177, BOT - Creating page): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54823&oldid=54821
19:36:45<@JAA>Oh, you crossposted to #wikiteam, yeah, better place, I guess.
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19:54:20<h2ibot>Exorcism edited Bugzilla (+82, /* Archived */): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54824&oldid=54797
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20:09:22<h2ibot>Exorcism edited Bugzilla (+34, /* Archived */): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54825&oldid=54824
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20:29:25<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Deathwatch (+9, /* 2015 */ Use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54826&oldid=54764
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20:30:25<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Deathwatch (+9, /* 2012 */ use "as of" template): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54827&oldid=54826
20:32:26<h2ibot>Cooljeanius edited Deathwatch (+9, /* Eleventh Hour Reprieves and Reanimations */…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=54828&oldid=54827
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20:34:26<h2ibot>Cooljeanius created Category talk:Pages containing potentially dated statements (+237, Created page with "== Sub-categories == On…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Category%20talk%3APages%20containing%20potentially%20dated%20statements
20:36:26<h2ibot>Cooljeanius created Template talk:As of (+231, Created page with "== Reference == Just linking…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?title=Template%20talk%3AAs%20of
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21:05:21<@JAA>Did we do anything with Foro 3DJuegos apart from the very incomplete AB job?
21:05:52<@JAA>I poked it a bit, and it's a mess. Even with the link deobfuscation, you might not find all content.
21:06:15<@JAA>There are also topics in groups/clans.
21:08:45<@JAA>It is possible to enumerate all topics with https://www.foro3djuegos.com/foros/tema/54327151/0/x/ , but because they use post IDs as topic identifiers, that takes 54.3M requests, and they have fairly tight rate limiting with ButtFront 403s when you exceed it. (That's an example of a 'community' = group/clan topic, too.)
21:13:41<@JAA>(54.3M + pagination)
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21:17:07<@JAA>FWIW, I haven't seen obfuscation on pagination links, so maybe the deobfuscation doesn't need to be implemented at all with that route.
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21:21:25<@JAA>monoxane: Asking again, did you ever get a reply from LFGSS/Microcosm about a list of sites?
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23:53:40<nicolas17>JAA: I believe the AB job was all we did

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