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00:10:13<@JAA>I guess we'll need LaTeX in our wiki soon.
00:19:53<fireonlive>😏
00:22:00<TheTechRobo>mfw when to read an archiveteam article you need a math degree
00:22:01<TheTechRobo>:P
00:25:45<fireonlive>TheTechRobo: heres one more for you https://wiki.archiveteam.org/index.php/Famous_Internet_videos
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00:46:19<rootliam>Hello, is there someone knowledgable about the yahoo video archives that could help me find which tar file a specific user id's videos are in? I've tried downloading file lists generated by the internet archive through a script but they seem to be incomplete
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01:09:51<nicolas17>where are those?
01:11:37<nicolas17>rootliam: are user IDs numeric?
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01:33:27<rootliam>Yeah, the one I'm looking for is 375869 and according to the wiki they got 0,300,000 - 0,400,000 so it should be in there somewhere
01:44:56<nicolas17>I can't find that range :|
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01:59:26<rootliam>It seems like they got split into a bunch of files but the ranges on some of them don't even make sense like 00045002-07439897
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02:01:10<rootliam>Maybe the only option is to just download all of them but I don't have the space or bandwidth to
02:01:23<flashfire42>.
02:03:04<flashfire42>How much temp storage do we have left? I wanna be aware if I can feed some more telegram stuff in
02:03:23<nicolas17>rewby:
02:05:18<thuban>rootliam: you could shoot underscor a message? most recently active account i can find is https://github.com/ab2525
02:06:23<nicolas17>only the giant 00000024-02442192 and 00045002-07439897 ranges would fit that number
02:07:50<thuban>it's not in either of those, they both just have stray extras at the beginning--the 'real' ranges are 2400026-2442192 and 7400007-7439897 respectively
02:10:28<nicolas17>I'll get their full file listings anyway, since I already started :P
02:10:57<nicolas17>yahoovideo-00000024-02442192.tar will take 8h to download oof
02:15:04<fireonlive>of
02:15:06<fireonlive>oof
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02:57:40<nicolas17>https://archive.org/download/ARCHIVETEAM-YV-008650000-008699944 no file extension?
02:57:42<nicolas17>these items are such a mess
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03:10:36<nicolas17>omg 256GB in a single .tar
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03:19:14<nicolas17>will a single continuous 256GB download from IA survive to completion?
03:19:23nic (nic) joins
03:19:29<nicolas17>we'll find out... in 48h or so
03:21:43<rootliam>I actually downloaded the extensionless/bz2 ones and made a program to extract the html files/file positions
03:27:19<rootliam>I would like to try and make a search engine for the archives besides just finding this specific user's uploads but that 2TB was all I had space for and it took multiple months to download so if you'd like I could upload the program and the data I extracted tomorrow
03:31:03<nicolas17>for now I'm doing "curl | tar tv" to get the file listings
03:31:45<fireonlive>nicolas17: aria2 and multiple threads? haha
03:32:02<nicolas17>fireonlive: that would require actually having the disk space to store the whole tar ;)
03:32:10<fireonlive>ahh :D
03:32:13<fireonlive>true :
03:32:14<fireonlive>:3
03:32:31<nicolas17>which I can do for some of these
03:32:34<nicolas17>but not the 256GB beasts
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03:35:09<thuban>i mean... is there something wrong with eg https://ia800407.us.archive.org/view_archive.php?archive=/0/items/ARCHIVETEAM-YV-0000000-0001000/ARCHIVETEAM-YV-0000000-0001000.zip ?
03:35:14<rootliam>Does tar tv store the position of the file inside the tar itself? My idea was to have javascript to get the flv out of the tar with a range request
03:36:39<nicolas17>thuban: for tars it seems to be highly incomplete
03:37:02<nicolas17>for zips I can use remotezip to get the file list without downloading the whole thing
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03:37:30<thuban>oh, the tar listing is itself incomplete? i thought the problem was just that not all the yahoo video data made it to ia
03:37:37<nicolas17>that *too* :P
03:37:51<thuban>fucked up
03:38:30<nicolas17>I think view_archive has to do the same linear process as 'tar tv' so it takes forever and soon gives up?
03:38:42<thuban>quite possible
03:39:04<thuban>regardless, it would be nice to track down the rest of that dataset...
03:39:09<nicolas17>absolutely
03:39:44<nicolas17>someone also mentioned repacking the tars into a more usable format, but I don't know if that was about yahoo video or about another project of a similar era
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04:02:11<@arkiver>thuban: pokechu22: so also https://transfer.archivete.am/l2Sws/orangefr_pagespro_scrubbed.txt.zst was run already though AB?
04:02:31<@arkiver>i see some lists are running through AB now - is that all the lists? so, anything not finished here is still 'to be done'?
04:02:39<@arkiver>or is there now more elsewhere still?
04:03:01<thuban>arkiver: it's running now, job 9t2wjsmi7nb9izhv58mnj4tnf
04:03:13<thuban>that's all the lists, yes
04:04:34<@arkiver>oh next time it might be good to run that though with --no-offsite-links
04:04:37<@arkiver>through*
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04:05:20<@arkiver>what response do you get if it rate limits you?
04:05:24<thuban>yeah, i wondered about that :S
04:05:55<thuban>(iirc you can do it the hacky way with a negative-lookahead ignore, but i don't have voice anyway, so)
04:06:05<@arkiver>6 AM here, so really need to take some sleep, but we'll get a little emergency project up, hopefully it'll finish in time
04:06:11<@arkiver>thuban: maybe JAA knows about that
04:06:22@arkiver has very little AB experience
04:06:43<thuban>don't recall about the rate-limiting, i'm afraid, but i'm pretty sure it's not 429
04:06:47<thuban>pokechu22 should know
04:13:52<pokechu22>You get timeouts for 24 hours
04:14:03<pokechu22>and/or refused connections
04:14:43<pokechu22>with no warning ahead of time (but it's generally OK with you running above the rate limit for a bit if you stop afterwards, it seems)
04:15:19<pokechu22>I didn't use --no-offsite-links because I expect it interacts with !a < list on multiple domains in weird ways
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04:17:32<pokechu22>I'll add an ignore that prevents it from using URLs without orange in the domain
04:18:05<nicolas17>hmm I think having the size of every file inside a tar, I can calculate the absolute position of files
04:21:35<pokechu22>added ^https?://(?![^/]*(orange|wanadoo)[^/]*)[^/]*/
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04:25:33<thuban>pokechu22: you also need woopic.com :/
04:27:37<pokechu22>oh
04:28:37<thuban>it's their cdn
04:28:52<pokechu22>well let's just hope that nothing much was missed by that - if there's still time, we can recheck skipped URLs (and we might as well do outlinks afterwards anyways)
04:29:19<thuban>was thinking the same thing
04:30:10<thuban>ty for fix :)
04:31:13<pokechu22>It's possible to requeue skipped URLs but that's a difficult process
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05:04:21<pabs>do we have a way of saving Twitter at the moment? https://nitter.net/steveharwell died
05:08:16<fireonlive>i've seen people using nitter.net or nitter.cz but last i heard they're rate limiting so have to go slow
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05:09:15<nicolas17>I could get a tar file listing somewhat faster by skipping over the actual file data
05:10:04<nicolas17>but it seems there's a yahoo-videos tar where that would be *especially* beneficial, because the videos inside are all like 100MB+, but I can't do it because it's .bz2 /o\
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07:13:35<h2ibot>Wessel1512 edited Deathwatch (+333, /* 2023 */): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=50713&oldid=50710
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08:42:36<pabs>interesting, a Google referrer makes twitter user pages public
08:44:50<flashfire42>pabs does that include privated accounts?
08:46:13<thuban>orange.fr is dead
08:47:03<AntoninDelFabbro|m>I confirm. ☚ī¸
08:51:48<pabs>flashfire42: not sure, got an example account?
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09:32:04<plcp>hi
09:33:13<plcp>pokechu22, thuban, someone from orange wrote me back, to say somethings like "orange's pagesperso has been suspended today, but we've acknowledged your request"
09:33:34<plcp>"we'll try to re-up the pages until the 30th of september, and then, they will be down forever"
09:34:12<plcp>I don't have much more info, but we may have got more time
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10:30:41<pabs>flashfire42, thuban: ^
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12:11:15<imer>Nice, good thing you asked :)
12:13:27<plcp>it's not done yet (fingers crossed)
12:14:08<qwertyasdfuiopghjkl>https://mastodon.0011.lt is shutting down tomorrow (2023-09-06): https://mastodon.0011.lt/@au0/110939313852541543 . JAA, arkiver: what's the current status on whether or not to archive mastodon instances (asking you since you were the ones who edited the wiki page)?
13:37:31<@arkiver>qwertyasdfuiopghjkl: let's put it in #archivebot
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13:53:43<qwertyasdfuiopghjkl>arkiver: to clarify, do you mean the conversation or the site?
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14:32:37<@arkiver>if it's shutting down, let's put it in AB
14:39:19<qwertyasdfuiopghjkl>ok, thanks :)
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14:55:07<qwertyasdfuiopghjkl>arkiver: Looks like ArchiveBot no longer works for mastodon instances due to JS :(
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15:14:07<qwertyasdfuiopghjkl>Is there any other way to archive it?
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16:03:17<@arkiver>orange is down :(
16:15:26<imer>arkiver: See above (9:32), might come back
16:23:04<pokechu22>It seems like it's partially online again?
16:29:40<pokechu22>ah, or just redirects to a dead domain - I can't load it currently :|
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16:41:24<@arkiver>plcp: that would be great news!
16:41:31<@arkiver>we can make a proper full copy then
16:41:35<fireonlive>fingers crossed :)
16:41:36<@arkiver>imer: thank for letting me know!
16:41:42<@arkiver>yeah :)
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16:56:27<pokechu22>I'm currently letting the archivebot jobs drain rather than saving the redirects to the dead domain
16:56:50<@arkiver>would probably be good to pause them and resume when the sites are back?
16:57:34<pokechu22>I guess - I thought the image domain was still alive so it would be useful to do those, but it's not
16:59:57<plcp>yeah dead redirs to end.pagesperso-orange.fr for now
17:00:40<pokechu22>Can you check the difference between http://laugerie.basse.pagesperso-orange.fr/ and http://laughing.gif.pagesperso-orange.fr/ for instance?
17:02:21<plcp>first is 302 as it was an existing site before, second is 404 as it doesn't exist?
17:02:41<pokechu22>Yeah, that's what I'd expect
17:03:07<plcp>I hope that orange guy didn't gave me false hopes tbh
17:03:09<pokechu22>so probably somewhat useful to leave the job that didn't finish iterating though all the possible sites alone just to record whether a site existed or not, even if it's not going to get anything
17:03:10<plcp>can only wait & see
17:06:27<pokechu22>Unrelated to that - what's the deal with free.fr? Is that ISP hosting as well, or is it something else?
17:07:07<plcp>is it ISP hosting
17:07:38<plcp>basically the same deal as orange's pagesperso, at some point they will pull the plug, but for now, its staying alive
17:07:45<pokechu22>Alright, we should probably do something about that sooner rather than later then
17:07:58<plcp>yup, lots of old personal webpages there
17:08:19<plcp>and most active orange's pagesperso migrated to free.fr btw :o)
17:08:36<plcp>also saw several sitew.com
17:09:12<plcp>as well as other misc web hosting services (most of the time these "create your website for free" ones)
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18:29:32<qwertyasdfuiopghjkl>arkiver: (mentioning it again in case you missed it since the shutdown is tomorrow) ArchiveBot couldn't get any posts or users on https://mastodon.0011.lt/ , even when starting from https://mastodon.0011.lt/about , as recommended in https://wiki.archiveteam.org/index.php/Mastodon . I'm guessing Mastodon used to previously work without JS, and the
18:29:32<qwertyasdfuiopghjkl>wiki page is outdated.
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18:59:44<pokechu22>I do remember hearing that mastodon worked without JS in the past and they removed that at some point
18:59:56<fireonlive>me too
19:04:22<fireonlive>https://github.com/mastodon/mastodon/issues/19953
19:05:11<fireonlive>as well as https://github.com/mastodon/mastodon/issues/23153
19:07:16<katia>mastodon seems clunky
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19:12:52<fireonlive>lots of new things don't really care about not having javascript because 'who turns it off'
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21:57:40<@JAA>qwertyasdfuiopghjkl: Yeah, I think Mastodon would require special tools now thanks to the JS without fallback.
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23:03:55<flashfire42|m>How is ingestion going?
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23:25:28Exdetransitioner (exdetransitioner) joins
23:26:02<Exdetransitioner>what about archiving gender-critical websites? it would be useful for scholars to study anti-trans websites of today in the future
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23:29:46<nicolas17>what about it?
23:30:03<nicolas17>give specific websites and someone will add them to archivebot I guess
23:30:10<SketchCow>I am not sure anti-trans websites are what "gender-critical" means
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23:30:13<audrooku|m>^
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23:30:22<SketchCow>Regardless, bigotry-a-go-go sites get archives all the time
23:30:37<audrooku|m>^ to give websites
23:30:43<Exdetransitioner>ovarit.com
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23:31:24<Exdetransitioner>supposedly "women-centered" but in reality it's a gatekept echo chamber thru invite codes
23:34:42<Exdetransitioner>there was also kiwi farms but i think it would have to have all the personal information redacted by AI
23:35:44<nicolas17>yeah I don't think it's worth doing any specific effort to archive kf
23:36:43<Exdetransitioner>nicolas17, all it really was it's pure noise
23:37:23<thuban>the operator has announced he'll release an archive if it ever shuts down
23:37:44<nicolas17>archiving the specific doxxing information would be counter-productive, and redacting specific parts of the content is.. not something we do, and would be way too much effort anyway
23:38:08<Exdetransitioner>nicolas17, yeah it would be harder than organizing elections
23:38:20<Exdetransitioner>you would need multiple people to verify everything
23:39:21<nicolas17>I mean, besides the "effort" part, we archive pristine HTTP responses including headers; if you need to modify the html to redact some content then it probably doesn't belong on the Wayback Machine
23:40:14<Exdetransitioner>another site that might be of interest is SEGM.org - an activist organization that's overplaying the negatives of gender-affirming treatments while underplaying the positives
23:40:43<Exdetransitioner>generally saying anything from this list would fit the bill: https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/RationalWiki:Webshites/Gender
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23:41:45<nicolas17>lol webshites
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23:42:15<Exdetransitioner>It's cited "really bad sources of information - or really good sources of bad information"
23:43:27<SketchCow>Oh yes, archiving kiwifarms, nobody has ever discussed that.
23:44:44<nicolas17>maybe it needs a wiki page to avoid rehashing the argument whenever it comes up
23:45:24<Exdetransitioner>might as well put homophobic sites at the same time https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/RationalWiki:Webshites/Sexuality
23:49:40<Exdetransitioner>that one is pretty vile https://www.ihmistenkirjo.net/english
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