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| 00:13:51 | <pokechu22> | Doesn't look too big, so I'll throw it in, though the custom software could cause issues |
| 00:14:26 | <mikolaj|m> | thanks |
| 00:15:24 | <pabs> | fireonlive: yeah, those are mirrors of various lists of lots of different kinds. there are a few such mirrors, for eg: mail-archive.com marc.info and formerly gmane.org/gmane.io |
| 00:15:26 | <mikolaj|m> | pokechu22: if I may ask, what issues could these be? |
| 00:15:49 | | pabs wonders if forum-dl supports those sorts of archives :) |
| 00:16:04 | <pokechu22> | We have a forums ignore set that prevents AB from trying to save stuff like the link to submit a new reply or to log in for various forum software |
| 00:16:16 | <pokechu22> | For custom stuff we'd need to come up with a list of those (though some forum software doesn't need it) |
| 00:17:33 | <dave> | DPReview is off death row, apparently! Acquired by some other site and will continue. https://www.dpreview.com/site-news/8298318614/dpreview-com-looks-forward-to-a-new-chapter-with-gear-patrol |
| 00:18:00 | <fireonlive> | pabs: ah ok :) |
| 00:18:01 | <pabs> | arkiver: re Album Archive, not sure as some folks on the HN threads were saying Album Archive also contains things like images uploaded to Blogspot |
| 00:18:26 | <mikolaj|m> | pabs: I can't support custom forums without some involved fuzzy logic / AI, the plan for now is to provide a quick way for the user to pass CSS selectors |
| 00:18:51 | <pabs> | these are mailing list archives mikolaj|m, but ack |
| 00:19:38 | <mikolaj|m> | pabs: ooh, you meant about:blank |
| 00:19:41 | <mikolaj|m> | dang! |
| 00:19:48 | <mikolaj|m> | you meant https://www.spinics.net/lists/ |
| 00:19:58 | <flashfire42> | Well then Dave finally an excuse for them to fix the grabs XD |
| 00:19:58 | <pabs> | yeah and mail-archive.com marc.info and formerly gmane.org/gmane.io |
| 00:20:20 | <pabs> | those are just mirrors though, the source data is elsewhere |
| 00:21:43 | <fireonlive> | theres a list of mailman2 on https://wiki.archiveteam.org/index.php/Mailman2 but idk if pabs has tooling for that already |
| 00:22:18 | <mikolaj|m> | pabs: spinics is MHonArc, which I haven't implemented yet :( . The rest appears custom |
| 00:22:52 | <fireonlive> | not sure whats en vogue these days |
| 00:23:08 | <fireonlive> | mailman3? |
| 00:26:35 | <@JAA> | HyperKitty is the modern one. |
| 00:26:54 | <mikolaj|m> | Hyperkitty, which is JS but provides Mbox dumps (though Wikipedia mailing lists have these disabled) |
| 00:26:56 | <@JAA> | Ft. modern shitty design patterns like requiring JS for trivial things etc. |
| 00:27:57 | <mikolaj|m> | yeah I don't like Hyperkitty, Pipermail is clunky but less overengineered |
| 00:28:57 | <pabs> | fireonlive: those I am just doing using ArchiveBot, mainly to preserve URL structure in the WBM |
| 00:28:58 | <mikolaj|m> | oh and last time I checked, the Hyperkitty Mbox dumps usually aren't uploaded to the Wayback Machine, so they might not be crawled or something |
| 00:29:07 | <fireonlive> | ah :) |
| 00:29:25 | <@JAA> | I'm slightly exaggerating as it is fairly usable even without JS, but yeah, I don't get why they built it like that rather than having a functional interface that's enhanced when you have JS enabled. |
| 00:30:15 | <mikolaj|m> | JAA: I disagree, I haven't found it usable without JS at all |
| 00:30:37 | <pabs> | I'm surprised it works at all without JS, the modern way to do web stuff is JS-only :) |
| 00:31:04 | <@JAA> | mikolaj|m: I just tested it on https://lists.mailman3.org/archives/list/mailman-users@mailman3.org/ and it works okay. |
| 00:31:27 | <@JAA> | 'All Threads' on the right gives a list of recent messages, and each message page has a 'Visit here for a non-javascript version of this page.' link at the bottom. |
| 00:32:36 | <dave> | JS enhancement is sadly dead because it's way harder than plugging json blobs into the latest hot react/vue/whatever, and those are happy to fail closed |
| 00:32:49 | <nicolas17> | JAA: https://twitter.com/mikenikles/status/1662518239388221440 |
| 00:33:20 | <dave> | everyone broadly agrees that progressive enhancement is a good idea, but in practice the only place I see it actually done is to compensate for screen size, because if your stuff is unusable on mobile you lose money |
| 00:33:41 | <dave> | sadly nobody loses (enough) money from people wanting to browse without js, or archive stuff :( |
| 00:33:43 | <@JAA> | ... which should be done with CSS media queries instead. :-P |
| 00:33:46 | <fireonlive> | nicolas17: T_T |
| 00:33:56 | <@JAA> | nicolas17: Yup, that sounds about right. :-/ |
| 00:35:03 | <mikolaj|m> | JAA: not all Hyperkitty instances I've found have this "Visit here for a non-javascript version of this page." |
| 00:35:10 | <@JAA> | Ah |
| 00:35:17 | <pabs> | pseudorizer: is anyone aware of mailing list Message-Id lookup services other than these? https://transfer.archivete.am/14Iekp/msgid-search-services.txt |
| 00:35:32 | <pabs> | er, woops, sorry pseudorizer. that was meant to be a PS: :) |
| 00:36:07 | <mikolaj|m> | JAA: for example, I see no such button here: https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/thread/SRHX3KLSYAEDCM4T35RSNNRWWLYVNCQB/ |
| 00:36:35 | <mikolaj|m> | might be because of an older version or something |
| 00:36:40 | <@JAA> | mikolaj|m: Indeed, looks like they're running an older version of HyperKitty and it was only recently added. :-| |
| 00:37:13 | <@JAA> | It was added in 1.3.6: https://docs.mailman3.org/projects/hyperkitty/en/latest/news.html#news-1-3-6 |
| 00:37:33 | <@JAA> | > Add the ability to view a thread without Javascript enabled. This uses the same mechanism we use with bot-detection and rendering of the entire page at once, which will be slow to load but allow reading. |
| 00:37:37 | <@JAA> | > slow to load |
| 00:37:54 | <fireonlive> | no one check the security fixes between versions |
| 00:37:57 | <fireonlive> | :3 |
| 00:38:35 | <fireonlive> | js-hell is 1000% faster than some html dont cha know |
| 00:38:43 | <@JAA> | Rather, let's load jQuery and jQuery UI to render some text. That'll be faster! |
| 00:38:56 | <fireonlive> | :D totally |
| 00:39:30 | <@JAA> | A quick test on mail.python.org loads ~570 kB of JS. Lovely. |
| 00:41:01 | <dave> | that's kinda light by today's standards! |
| 00:41:25 | | @JAA now playing: Metallica - Sad But True |
| 00:41:26 | <dave> | it didn't even download an entire wasm runtime for a completely different language's VM |
| 00:43:45 | <mikolaj|m> | I wish HTML had some semantic tags for pagination. I think that could resolve a lot of cases where JS is used |
| 00:44:10 | <@JAA> | You mean like <link rel="next" ...>? |
| 00:45:02 | <@JAA> | Can also be used on <a> but is rarer there. |
| 00:45:26 | <mikolaj|m> | JAA: oh yeah, I forgot about that |
| 00:45:50 | <mikolaj|m> | except that it's not very often used, and I don't know if it's even standardized? |
| 00:46:03 | <mikolaj|m> | and moreover, sometimes it's used oddly |
| 00:46:21 | <@JAA> | It is standardised, and it is used a fair bit. Certainly not ubiquitous though. |
| 00:46:35 | <mikolaj|m> | for example, in this thread: http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?PHPSESSID=e3d75652abb8fb732e04c8a1bffba02a&topic=406.0 |
| 00:46:55 | <nicolas17> | I recently wrote https://data.nicolas17.xyz/pallas-explorer.html and it very much requires JS but I'm proud of how many third-party libraries I used |
| 00:46:59 | <mikolaj|m> | it points to the next thread, not to the next thread page |
| 00:47:15 | <@JAA> | Also, HTML5 allows custom elements, so you could have <pagination><a rel="prev" href="?page=2">Prevous page</a> ...</pagination. |
| 00:47:31 | <@JAA> | But yeah, that wouldn't be standardised. |
| 00:47:41 | <dave> | modern HTML, especially with additions like ARIA, is surprisingly expressive by itself these days |
| 00:47:49 | <fireonlive> | https://images2.imgbox.com/ea/4f/cGM4ZpJq_o.png |
| 00:48:07 | <fireonlive> | 5.3MB transferred for new reddit; 12.3MB uncompressed? |
| 00:50:00 | <nicolas17> | http://vanilla-js.com/ |
| 00:52:21 | <imer> | thats pretty funny |
| 00:52:53 | <nicolas17> | imer: it's the framework I used in the above pallas-explorer page :3 |
| 01:12:18 | <fireonlive> | ahh vanilla js |
| 01:12:19 | <fireonlive> | :3 |
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| 03:07:34 | <h2ibot> | Leo60228 edited Reddit (+326, Mention possible mass-deletion by admins): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=49986&oldid=49950 |
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| 07:05:24 | <h2ibot> | MasterX244 edited Reddit (+55, Formatting fix, addition was past the…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=49987&oldid=49986 |
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| 07:27:14 | <masterx244|m> | (+55 since i added a more obvious "stopper" comment over the easy to miss strike tag) |
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| 10:12:10 | <pabs> | Moog sold to InMusic https://ra.co/news/79174 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36414915 |
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| 13:31:00 | <rktk> | :( |
| 13:31:21 | <rktk> | It looks like there's a huge amount of new spam Lemmy accounts and instances being created, pushing the total user count past 1 million |
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| 14:13:20 | <rktk> | i wish linkedin would burn to the ground |
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| 21:40:22 | <h2ibot> | Nemo bis edited Miraheze (+149, more like 3k; not sure what happens to the…): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=49988&oldid=49977 |
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| 22:10:28 | <nicolas17> | how's the capacity now that reddit and lineblog are doing retries? |
| 22:10:37 | <nicolas17> | should we unpause imgur? |
| 22:10:57 | <nicolas17> | hm although reddit is sustaining 10GiB/min anyway |
| 22:11:42 | <@arkiver> | yes i'm unpausing imgur |
| 22:17:20 | <fireonlive> | have all the lists been dumped on reddit? |
| 22:17:53 | <@arkiver> | still one list with image URLs from masterx244|m but need to look better into that |
| 22:18:22 | <fireonlive> | ah ok |
| 22:18:34 | <fireonlive> | nice we got through the huge backlog though! |
| 22:22:49 | <flashfire42> | Time to switch to archiveteam choice and head to work |
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| 23:00:38 | <h2ibot> | JAABot edited CurrentWarriorProject (+4): https://wiki.archiveteam.org/?diff=49989&oldid=49976 |
| 23:06:04 | <fireonlive> | good bot! |
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